| Author | Message | ||
     Maggie Leman Moderator Username: maggieleman Post Number: 111 Registered: 07-2005 Posted From: 71.111.205.236 Rating: N/A |
It is very hard to get the tube down the wrong way on a conscious goat. You will need to use some sort of mouth speculum (a dowel inserted sideways to keep her from closing her teeth) to keep the doe from biting the tube completely through. Use a real stomach tube about 1/4 inch in diameter, measure it along the body from the mouth to the last rib and mark it. Lube the tube with water or lube. Put the mouth speculum in and insert the tube gently down the throat until you reach the mark. You can also insert the tube through the nose and avoid having to use a speculum. You can attach a funnel to the end and pour fluids in or use a big syringe or a turkey baster. When you are done blow on the end of the tube to clear the last of the fluids and gently pull the tube out. You may find it is easier to use a turkey baster to get a thin soupy gruel to the back of her tongue to allow her to swallow. Try both ways. Do NOT use a hose or a horse or cow stomach tube, these are too big and will damage the esophagus. At the very least you need to be sure she is getting enough water. But if she has been going for 5 days she is obviously drinking something. Maggie Leman Goat 911 Capri Medic | ||
| Brenda D. New member Username: brendad Post Number: 2 Registered: 08-2005 Posted From: 152.16.83.191 Rating: N/A |
Tetanus is likely needed (I'll check on this); banamine was given for four days and LA200 every 3 days through today. The vet confirmed no indication of a break; drenching or tubing liquids was considered problematic because of possible swelling of the throat tissues and potential aspiration. Is there a good procedure to avoid the airway? P.S. The dog won't be hurting anything else. | ||
| Maggie Leman Moderator Username: maggieleman Post Number: 110 Registered: 07-2005 Posted From: 64.102.64.113 Rating: N/A |
Is/was she on antibiotics? Is she current on her tetanus vaccination? Was she given tetanus antitoxin? The dog may have broken her jaw or may have actually bitten her tongue or inside her mouth. Once the swelling goes down her mouth and tongue heals or the break starts to heal she may get control of her tongue back and be able to chew and swallow normally again. The teeth grinding sound is usually a sign of pain, not chewing. Giving a pain reliever/inflammation reducer may help. Banamine would be best at 0.1 cc per 10 pounds by SQ injection once a day for no more than a week. Or you can try Liquid Children's Motrin at 1 cc per 10 pounds every 4 to 6 hours. Tube or use a turkey baster to make sure she is getting enough water. She needs about a gallon a day. You can also make a "soup" of the oatmeal and drench or tube her with that too. THE DOG WILL BE BACK TO FINISH THE JOB!! Maggie Leman Goat 911 Capri Medic | ||
| Brenda D. New member Username: brendad Post Number: 1 Registered: 08-2005 Posted From: 152.16.83.191 Rating: N/A |
Our herd matriarch Bebe was attacked by a dog 5 days ago. She has a gash to the bone on the left side of her face, punctures at her throat, and skin insuries on her back leg (I sprang for a vet). The BIG QUESTION is why her tongue sticks out a little on the right of her mouth, and she doesn't suck up liquids like goats do. Could there be nerve or throat damage? She tries to eat hay but it stays in the same place until I pull it out. Protein mineral block, oatmeal, applesauce, water and Gatorade are vigorously "mouthed" (her tongue works on it and teeth make grinding noises) but I can't tell if she's swallowing any of it. I've seen her pass water but her weight is down. Her temp was low but is getting close to normal now. Is there anything else I should be doing? (Pam, I hope your doe is doing well.) | ||
| Maggie Leman Moderator Username: maggieleman Post Number: 80 Registered: 07-2005 Posted From: 71.111.205.236 Rating: N/A |
Continue the antibiotics for at least 4 to 7 more days. Some of the wounds were undoubtedly deep and since she still has open places even with dressings keeping things clean is hard. Glad to hear she is doing well. Maggie Leman Goat 911 Capri Medic | ||
| pamwilliams New member Username: pamwilliams Post Number: 6 Registered: 08-2005 Posted From: 67.136.143.194 Rating: N/A |
 Well my doe is doing much better...her wounds are actually healing nicely,,,i just need for the new skin to grow over the wounds...but her swelling is going down, and she is eating pretty good and drinking. I am still giving the antibiotics and motrin for a couple more days. her nerves seem to be finally settling as well. thanks for all your help. | ||
| Maggie Leman Moderator Username: maggieleman Post Number: 75 Registered: 07-2005 Posted From: 71.111.205.236 Rating: N/A |
Give 1500 units of the antitoxin and repeat every 2 weeks until she is well on the way to being healed. Read the bottle for teh number of units in each ml (1 ml is 1 cc). The compresses would probably feel good. Maggie Leman Goat 911 Capri Medic | ||
| pamwilliams New member Username: pamwilliams Post Number: 5 Registered: 08-2005 Posted From: 67.136.142.70 Rating: N/A |
Thanks Maggie, I had no luck with the bamimine...vets will not dispense without seeing the goat, and charging an arm and leg...I did get the tetnus antitoxin, but do not know the dosage...also gave her some sweet feed, and she was very interested and nibbled a bit, also drank on her own...think I will take you up on oatmeal. I found some concentrated electrolytes for horses and gave that as well... she is not sluggish at all...matter of fact she seems to be a bit peeved. Her poor face is so swollen now. wonder if warm compressess would help. please advise about the tetanus. Thanks. | ||
| Maggie Leman Moderator Username: maggieleman Post Number: 73 Registered: 07-2005 Posted From: 64.102.64.113 Rating: N/A |
Try making her a soupy oatmeal (just like for people) with a bit of molasses, something she can slurp up. Lots of injured and sick goats love this! Maggie Leman Goat 911 Capri Medic | ||
| pamwilliams New member Username: pamwilliams Post Number: 4 Registered: 08-2005 Posted From: 67.136.144.26 Rating: N/A |
Well this doe has got to be the strongest willed one yet. She is still quite fiesty this am. Changed her bandages, and her wounds, especially the neck wound that I was so worried about are looking very good. She is of course still quite swollen, and is off feed, I think it hurts to much to eat..I am going to see if I can find any banamine around these parts... | ||
| Maggie Leman Moderator Username: maggieleman Post Number: 70 Registered: 07-2005 Posted From: 71.111.205.236 Rating: N/A |
My goal in life, so many have helped me over the years, and I LOVE to read and collect textbooks. All kinds but my goat veterinary textbook collection is extensive and I do have a good bit of medical training, for both people and animals. Goats have been a real focus, don't ask me about birds. But I know quite a bit about dogs and reptiles! Maggie Leman Goat 911 Capri Medic | ||
| Daniel and Peggy Fultz New member Username: danfultz5 Post Number: 8 Registered: 10-2005 Posted From: 199.199.236.173  Rating: N/A |
Great Advice Maggie...you've saved a goat or two or hundreds!!! | ||
| Maggie Leman Moderator Username: maggieleman Post Number: 69 Registered: 07-2005 Posted From: 71.111.205.236 Rating: N/A |
If you have given a CDT shot she is protected. The feedstore will not have the antitoxin, but you can order it online from Jeffers or Valley vet. Maggie Leman Goat 911 Capri Medic | ||
| Maggie Leman Moderator Username: maggieleman Post Number: 68 Registered: 07-2005 Posted From: 71.111.205.236 Rating: N/A |
Yes tetanus is the T part of CDT. The CD is clostridia types C and D, the most common causes of enterotoxemia. All farm livestock should be vaccinated for Tetanus at the very least, it exists in all soils and in many livestock digestive tracts, especially horses. So soil contaminated with poop would have tetanus in it. You should be vaccinated too really...The wounds that most often harbor tetanus are the deep penetrating kind. They look tiny, you may not even see one on an animal. They heal over the top and the tetanus germ takes hold in this ideal environment. It is a very bad way for an animal to die. Maggie Leman Goat 911 Capri Medic | ||
| Daniel and Peggy Fultz New member Username: danfultz5 Post Number: 7 Registered: 10-2005 Posted From: 199.199.236.173 Rating: N/A |
Maggie will be the one to answer this... I would give Tetanus Antitoxin (works immediately but negates any Tetanus Toxiod given..you will need to boost in a couple weeks a Tetanus toxoid (Toxoid takes two weeks to take full effect-Antitoxin take effect immediately to counter tetanus poisoning)...CD& T is a Clostridium type toxiod with Tetanus toxoid vaccine. | ||
| Maggie Leman Moderator Username: maggieleman Post Number: 67 Registered: 07-2005 Posted From: 71.111.205.236 Rating: N/A |
For banamine the dose is 0.1 cc per 10 pounds given by SQ injection every 12 to 24 hours for only a few days to avoid ulcerating the digestive tract. Given orally ulceration starts nearly immediately, given by injection the digestive tract is somewhat protected. The dose for Motrin is approximately twice the adult dose. When using Liquid Children's motrin 1 cc per 10 pounds is usually quite effective, but not as effective as banamine. Aspirin does not do well in the rumen it is largely broken down rapidly, so the dose is quite high, 1 regular tablet per 10 pounds every 4 to 6 hours as needed. Bute is not recommended for ruminants due to it's damaging effect (ulcers once again). All 4 drugs are NSAIDS, non steroidal anti inflammatory drugs. They are not really closely related in chemical make up, but nearly all caution about the possiblity of digestive tract bleeding and ulcers. Maggie Leman Goat 911 Capri Medic | ||
| pamwilliams New member Username: pamwilliams Post Number: 3 Registered: 08-2005 Posted From: 67.136.143.114 Rating: N/A |
oh, forgot is the tetnas the cd/t shot? i asked at the feed store and they said...nahh you don't need tetnas...agghhh | ||
| pamwilliams New member Username: pamwilliams Post Number: 2 Registered: 08-2005 Posted From: 67.136.143.114 Rating: N/A |
Thanks, heading out to the barn asap for the meds..is banamine over the counter? as for our dog, he just had a check up and all his shots...and believe it or not he is on the strongest electric zapper on the market and decided it was worth the pain. We will be getting rid of him. thanks for the info. | ||
| Daniel and Peggy Fultz New member Username: danfultz5 Post Number: 5 Registered: 10-2005 Posted From: 199.199.236.173 Rating: N/A |
Maggie: is it true that Banamine equivalant is Motrim and Bute equivalent is Aspirin if you need to use Motrim or Aspirin I've heard basically the same dose you would give an adult? You have the medical background it seems for this type query. Thanks for responding to Pam's emergency so quick too!!! Peg | ||
| Maggie Leman Moderator Username: maggieleman Post Number: 66 Registered: 07-2005 Posted From: 71.111.205.236 Rating: |
You do need to start an antibiotic the LA 200 is only a problem if given over a very long time like months. GIve for 5 to 7 days once a day by SQ injection (DO NOT GIVE THIS DRUG ORALLY!!!) at 1 cc per 30 pounds. She needs antibiotics as dog bite wounds almost always become very infected. Hopefully she is up to date on her tetanus? If not vaccinate now. Give the motrin, she truly needs pain relief, she is in agony. Drench her with fluids, dehydration will kill her. Chain the dang dog! He will try all the harder for her now. It is very possible with this trauma she will abort. Maggie Leman Goat 911 Capri Medic | ||
| Daniel and Peggy Fultz New member Username: danfultz5 Post Number: 4 Registered: 10-2005 Posted From: 199.199.236.173 Rating: N/A |
I would be using Banamine for pain/swelling/fever and penicillin asap!!! along with Fortified Vit B comp and watch her fluid intake. Don't worry about loosing the baby..you'll need to worry about not loosing her first. | ||
| pamwilliams New member Username: pamwilliams Post Number: 1 Registered: 08-2005 Posted From: 67.136.143.114 Rating: N/A |
I HAVE A DOE THAT GOT HER HEAD STUCK IN THE FENCE, AND OUR DOG GOT TO HER...WE WERE ABLE TO GET HER OUT BEFORE SHE WAS KILLED, BUT HER FACE IS TORE UP. SHE HAS A LARGE TEAR IN THE NECK AREA, AND SHE HAS SEVERAL LARGE GASHES, AND POSSIBLY EVEN PUNCTURES ON THE FACE. BELIEVE IT OR NOT SHE IS STILL STANDING 36 HOURS LATER. I IMMEDIATELY CLEANED THE AREAS THE BEST I COULD AND THEN SLATHERED FURAZONE AND STERIL BANDAGES ON THE WOUNDS, AND CHANGED THE DRESSINGS AGAIN THIS AM. I NOTICED TODAY THAT SHE IS NOT DRINKING OR REALLY EATING. I DID TRY AND DRENCH HER SLIGHTLY. HER HORNS AND HER FACE OF COURSE FEEL REAL WORM,AND IS SWOLLEN. I AM WORRIED ABOUT FEVER, AND INFECTION. I DID NOT GIVE LA200, BECAUSE SHE IS MOST LIKE PREGNANT AS OF THIS MONTH. I ALSO WORRY ABOUT STRESSING HER OUT WITH TRYING TO SHOVE SOME PILLS DOWN HER THROAT WITH HER CONDITION, WAS GOING TO TRY AND GIVE CHILDRENS TYLENOL/MOTRIN. ANY SUGGESTIONS AS TO WHAT TO DO. VET IS NOT AN OPTION. |
